Previous | Mem | Tell a Friend | Next
 
princess non sequitur
blueraccoon
22 April 2008 @ 01:09 pm
a world of oh fuck no.  
The Open Source Boob Project.

The first time I read this, I laughed. I thought it was satire. A very telling commentary on society as it stands and the objectification of women and so on.

Then I found out [info]theferret was serious.

I just...in what world, what possible world, is it okay for a group of men to walk up to a woman and say "May I touch your breasts?" In what universe do women have to opt-out of having their breasts fondled in public by complete strangers?

[info]the_red_shoes has a list of some of the good responses.

The best comment I've seen is here.

As a woman--fuck that. As a human being, I just don't understand how anyone can accept this, how we can say "Sure, it's okay for a group of strange men to walk up to a woman and ask to grope her" for no other reason than the MEN want to. Peer pressure much? "Oh, all the women are doing it." Yeah, fuck that.

I like my boobs. I wish they were smaller, but that's neither here nor there. Mostly I like them. I am NOT OKAY with strangers coming up to me and asking if they can fondle my boobs.

Pardon me while I seethe.

eta: I feel like I need to edit this to make another point. I am a physically affectionate person. I love hugs and snuggles and have been a part of some very fun people piles at cons and SCA events and things. I hold hands with Morgan in public and I flat out like being touched. (give me a back rub, I'll generally ask you to marry me.)

This? This is none of that. This is not about friendly, safe physical contact. This is about men finding excuses and ways to grope women in public. This skeeves me out and scares me--what if I'm alone and a bunch of men come up to me and ask to fondle my boobs? I can say no, but if they don't take that for an answer and start pressuring me, what do I do then?

I'm not being as articulate as I want to be here because I'm so angry and upset over this I can't get it out correctly. I have male friends who read this blog--do you think it's okay to walk up to a strange woman and ask if you can squeeze her tits?
 
12 people rambling | ramble at me
 
( Post a new comment )
KarieAuthoress[info]karieflybabe on April 22nd, 2008 08:29 pm (UTC)
Pardon me while I gape and bluster and... headdesk!
Ways of Seeing[info]waysofseeing on April 22nd, 2008 09:26 pm (UTC)
Ferrett updated his post later today, I think because he realized that he'd unleashed a monster. Quoting, in part:

Unfortunately, one of the things about life is that what works in a microcosm does not work in a macrocosm. And while yeah, despite the many who’ve said this is just another exercise in dumb male power and pathetic women, the important thing is this:

Women should feel safe.

And the chances that the Project would get fucked up, making con spaces more amenable to hordes of stalkers and mouthbreathers who will grope and maul women, are pretty damn big. Hell, it’s already made women feel less safe by me mentioning it, and that makes me feel like shit. As it should.

The Project itself, at least as done at Penguicon, has been turned by the miracle of reposting into some nightmare of eternal groping, female hunting, and a constant stream of denigration. And while that’s not the way it happened - at least from the perspective of the folks who participated that I’ve heard from who have expressed positive opinions behind f-locked posts because they don't want to endure the commentstreams that I’m getting…

…It doesn’t matter. Scalzi, as usual, got it right: It was highly context-specific. What happened to us, even if it was good, is not what will happen to you. The danger of it getting out of hand is too great – and already, people worry that they’re going to be press-ganged into a groping area if they don’t have a button, despite the fact that I (and others) have said that’s not what happened at all. But honestly? That easily could happen without proper supervision, male power being what it is…

And the fear is something that can be triggering in itself. I do get that. And nobody should be triggered.

If I’ve contributed to the idea that women are not safe, then I’ve failed with a capital “F,” regardless of the underlying reality. And if people think that all cons are filled with horrific swarms of gropers, well, then I’ve also failed.

So let me say this: Don’t try it. Some folks have wanted to because well, they see that it could be something healthy and sexual, but chances are someone’s going to end up alienated and skeezed. If you’re going to do this at in the entirety of a con-space, no matter how carefully you try to set the boundaries, you’re going to encroach on space that shouldn’t be occupied. Do not.
princess non sequitur[info]blueraccoon on April 22nd, 2008 09:27 pm (UTC)
I did see that, yes. I still don't feel any better about it. The fact that he thought this was a good idea in the first place...yeah, there's no back-pedaling from that.
Ways of Seeing[info]waysofseeing on April 22nd, 2008 09:39 pm (UTC)
Can't blame you for your disgust.

Most of my thoughts about the whole thing were better expressed by others in this comment thread on [info]peaseblossom's journal.

Edited for borked HTML

Edited at 2008-04-22 09:40 pm (UTC)
princess non sequitur[info]blueraccoon on April 22nd, 2008 09:42 pm (UTC)
Yeah, and I agree with most stuff in that thread. In theory I like the idea of cuddle parties; I think we do tend to be touch-starved as a society and encouraging positive experiences of touch among people who want that experience is something I'm all for.

But this...wasn't any of that, not really.
Cara Chapel[info]cara_chapel on April 22nd, 2008 09:27 pm (UTC)
The bastard went and deleted all the comments off his first post, too.
[info]crimsonquills on April 22nd, 2008 09:34 pm (UTC)
My God, just reading that post made me feel skeezy. Naively, I suppose, I assumed that it was incredibly obvious that just the idea of such a project would be incredibly invasive and pressuring and threatening. Hell, I've been uncertain about hugging (is it okay to hug this person? does this person expect to hug me? should I let them? if they hug everyone in a group but not me, is that because they don't know me or because I'm projecting 'don't touch me' or because they don't want to hug me? and sometimes, after hugging someone I don't know very well, I've been known to think later, was that okay? did they mind? were they uncomfortable? should I not have hugged them? I still worry about past hugs sometimes), never mind boob touching. I'm stunned that there was a group of people who thought it was a good idea!

This actually made me feel a bit twitchy about MediaWest next month. By now I know almost everyone at BASCon by sight and/or reputation, if not personally. But MediaWest is a lot bigger. I'm sure it'll be fine, but just the idea that this idea is out there... *shivers*
Viridian5[info]viridian5 on April 22nd, 2008 10:59 pm (UTC)
When talking about The Open Source Boob Project with my roommate, I told her about the pressure I've gotten from friends and family--no sexual connotations involved--over my highly negative reaction to being touched. Mom says I've shied away from it since I was baby. I find being touch jarring and painful at worse, particularly if I'm not expecting it. I've had friends try to "cure" me with hugs and unexpected pouncing.) I mentioned the hound dog eyes and "don't you love me?" reactions and how acquaintances demanded explanations and would keep on me about it until they were satisfied. How I must not like touch because I must have been abused, and since I don't remember abuse I must be repressing it.

My roommate responded, "Oh no, that's completely a sign of abuse." ::facepalm::

Some people don't want to be touched. They have their reasons and shouldn't have to explain them to people. Being asked makes me feel harassed. Being asked by people I don't even know makes it worse.
Kroroboros: Stupidity[info]kroroboros on April 23rd, 2008 12:27 am (UTC)
do you think it's okay to walk up to a strange woman and ask if you can squeeze her tits?

Speaking as a male my answer to this question is simply...Hell No!

Emma: NCIS Caf-Pow![info]mylogiceatsyou on April 23rd, 2008 12:39 am (UTC)
So many people said this so much more articulately than I ever could, but my lord what was he thinking?

How many girls were made to feel inadequate because their boobs weren't deemed worthy to be touched by some creepy guy with wandering hands?

BLEGH.
Andee[info]kjpepper on April 23rd, 2008 02:45 am (UTC)
meh. if more women were taught to use their god given knees instead of to be "nice" this discussion wouldn't even be on the table. Am I outraged? Not particularly; in fact I'm already weary of seeing it posted everywhere. Nor am I particularly surprised. Immaturity is to geekdom as roaches are to New York.
jycaegima[info]jycaegima on April 23rd, 2008 04:53 am (UTC)
You are not alone. I have been seething about this all day.